Expressions / jeu

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Message de larenaudiere posté le 2004-11-27 21:40:15 (S | E | F | I)
I am living in Vendée and there are a lot of english people.Every Thursday I go for a walk with them.During the last stroll an English woman said:

It looks dark over Will's mother's.

What does this expression mean?

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Edité par bridg le 27-11-2004 21:45
à la 3ème expression postée il me semble que c'est un jeu? titre changé en ce sens

Réponse: re:Expression de serena, postée le 2004-11-27 23:04:41 (S | E)
It looks dark over Will's mother's.

Je crois qu'elle veut dire ça a l'air sombre au dessus de la maison de la mère de Will.

Réponse: re:Expression de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-11-28 05:22:38 (S | E)
Well done Serena.
Can you tell me the origin of this expression?
I noticed,English people only living in the south of England knew this expression.

Réponse: re:Expression de gewurz, postée le 2004-11-28 05:33:28 (S | E)
It's because the weather is always fine in the rest of England
Sorry.
(I'm going to hide under the veil of shame)

Réponse: Another expression de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-11-28 05:31:45 (S | E)
I"ll go to the foot of our stairs

What does this expression mean?
Good luck!

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Edité par bridg le 28-11-2004 08:34

Réponse: Expressions de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-11-28 10:38:35 (S | E)
Yesterday,I went at English's house for dinner.In the conversation,someone said:

I will go to the foot of our stairs'.

I am sure,you are going to find the meaning of this sentence.
Good luck.

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Edité par bridg le 28-11-2004 11:43

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-01 09:36:47 (S | E)
Hi !

Gewruz, don't be ashamed, your idea is not so bad !!
I don't even know where this expression comes from.

However, for I"ll go to the foot of our stairs, I can give an explanation.
English people say it to express their astonishment to something they find so obvious that it's no use saying it.
I've never been in England to declare that it's a sarcastic way of speaking. But I do think it is, according to the context I usually find it in my books.
And this expression comes from the North of England, it's even mostly used in Yorkshire.

Maybe they'll say this when they read gewuz explanation for "It looks dark over Will's mother's" ! ( It's a joke !! ).

See you then for a better idea ! ..... and why not giving another expression ?

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de pj, postée le 2004-12-01 09:45:11 (S | E)
The most popular topic of conversation in the British Isles must be the weather and so there must be a lot of folk lore ways to interpret it. One Hampshire way of saying a storm is approaching is "It looks dark over Will's mother's." But I don't know who "Will" was!

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-01 10:04:02 (S | E)
Hello pj,

I hope larenaudiere will tell us who's this "Will".

A question please :
By saying "It looks dark over Will's mother's", do they also mean something bad is going to happen ? Not only about the weather.
Just like we say in French : " Il y a de l'orage dans l'air" ? And this is a figurative sense to show that so-and-so will have problems.

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-03 05:49:51 (S | E)
Serena,Pj.
I was very interested in your explanations.
Yesterday evening,I had dinner with English people.One of them said:
As you know,I am English and was brought up in the South East of England,the county of East Sussex.At that time-some 50 years ago-it was a very rural country area.
My parants,grandparents and family used the expression"It looks a bit dark over Will's mothers"to suggest that it might soon rain or snow,I don't think it had other significance.He added Will must be the diminutive of William.
The other expression "I'll go to the foot of our stairs" I have always thought,comes from much further north in england.I think it was used to indicate astonishment.I believe it is still in use today but not common as it used to be.
For us southern folk it has always been thought of with humour.
If you have any problems about that,let me know.

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-03 05:59:28

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-04 00:26:11 (S | E)
Hi larenaudiere,

I guessed "will" was the diminutive of "william". And if you didn't tell us who's william, I suppose you don't know either, do you ?

As for the first explanation, it's ok for me, thanks !
When you "catch" other expressions from your British friends, let us share them once more with you please !

See you !

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-06 06:00:34 (S | E)
,Hello Serena,
It is difficult to know who Will was.It was a very common name,there were a lot of Wills,so It seems reasonable that all the people called Will had mothers.It follows then that there were also a lot of Wills mothers.I have no other explanation.I don't think there is a real answer,don't forget that after all It is just an old saying.
See you soon.
Larenaudiere.

Je voudrais savoir pourquoi il apparait "modifier ce message" alors que toi quand tu réponds ça n'apparait pas.

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-06 06:14:20

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-06 15:41:30 (S | E)
Hi larenaudière !

Thanks for answering.
You're right when saying we can't know the real origin of "will's mother".
As the British like the name "William" ( and I do too ).

There's a sentence I read in a book last time. Of course I know who used it, but not its origin. So, can you tell me ?

The buck stops here.

See you !

PS : "Modifier ce message" s'affiche uniquement sur les messages du membre qui les a postés afin qu'il puisse les éditer à sa guise. Donc, tu es le seul à pouvoir le voir sur ton post, et pas sur le mien ( et vice versa ), puisque aucun n'a le droit de changer les posts des autres.
Sauf bien sûr les modérateurs qui les voient sur TOUS les posts.

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Edité par marie37400 le 08-12-2004 10:54

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de pj, postée le 2004-12-06 15:51:13 (S | E)
The saying "the buck stops here" derives from the slang expression "pass the buck" which means passing the responsibility on to someone else. The latter expression is said to have originated with the game of poker, in which a marker or counter, frequently in frontier days a knife with a buckhorn handle, was used to indicate the person whose turn it was to deal. If the player did not wish to deal he could pass the responsibility by passing the "buck," as the counter came to be called, to the next player.

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-06 17:07:13 (S | E)
Thank you pj !!!

All what I know about this saying is that it was used by the former American president Harry Truman, and it was hanged on the wall of his office.
Now, can I suppose he meant that he was the only one to be responsible for everything, and nobody had to give a point of view ?

( Note : I'm not trying to talk politics. Just need to understand this. )

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-07 18:57:47 (S | E)
,Serena,
My answer will be like the PJ's answer.
The buck stops here comes from to pass the buck.Origin: Passes the reponsability of something to someone else.I found an explanation in a French's book.I'll translate that in English.It will be a good exercise for me.
During poker games in Western USA,the person who is dealing the cards has a piece of lead(buckshot)in front of him,when he loses his turn to deal,he passes the cards-and the lead -to someone else.In eastern USA,where they are more sophisticated,"the buck" is replaced with a silver dollar and since then,American money has been known as "a buck".
Now, you will understand without problem the shrewdnessin:The buck stops here.
See you soon.
Larenaudiere.

Another expression:ALL MY EYE AND BETTY MARTIN

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-08 06:59:40

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-08 10:47:42 (S | E)
Hello !

I uderstand quite well your explanations, but still can't guess why Truman used it, and in his office above all.
Well, we won't spend our time talking about this, so let's start struggling with your new expression.

ALL MY EYE AND BETTY MARTIN = all nonsense, rubbish !

For the origin, I have no idea. So I trust pj, no doubt that he'll help me ! . Unless I find something before he comes back !

Thanks larenaudière !

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de pj, postée le 2004-12-09 11:01:59 (S | E)
All my eye (and Betty Martin) : nonsense.
This was first explained by a commentator writing in 1823 as a corruption of 'O mihi, beate Martine...' (O grant me, blessed Martin) from the words of a Latin prayer to St Martin. It is said to have been picked up abroad by sailors and to have come into english use in the 18th century by way of nautical slang.

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-09 12:47:28 (S | E)
Great ! Thank you pj !
I knew I could count on you !

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-11 06:03:25 (S | E)
,
Well done Serena and PJ.
The phrase or saying,all my eye and Betty Martin means that something is total and complete nonsense.It is found in British English from the eighteenth on,but is hardly known today.First recorder in a letter of 1781 collected in W H Hutton's Burford Papers.We also know that all my eye,with the same sense,is at least half a century older.
By the 1780s,the phrase was clearly well established and well-known.Jon Bee(a pseudonym for one John Badcock,about whom very little is known) suggested in 1823 in his Slang,a Dictionary of the Turf,the Ring,the Chase,that it came from a Latin prayer,Ora pro mihi,beate Martine("Pray for me,blessed Martin") presumably St Martin of Tours,patron saint of innkeepers and reformed drunkards.Most scholards reject this,since no trace of this prayer has been found anywhere in the Latin liturgy,and It's ungrammatical anyway.For an even more way out-suggestion,try Dr L A Waddell,who in 1914 suggested in his book The phoenicien Origins of Britons,Scots,and Anglo-Saxons that the phrase came from O mihi,Brito Martis,or"Oh(bring help) to me,Brito Martis".She was a goddess associated with Crete,Whom Dr Waddell linked to Britain via the Phoenicians who traded for Cornish tin.

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-11 10:46:53

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-12 14:36:19 (S | E)
Wow ! What a story ! Thank you larenaudière, I learnt so many things thanks to you. And still hope you'll find some more.

See you soon ?

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-15 09:47:24 (S | E)
Hello Serena and PJ,

Another expression:"Going to hell in a handbasket".
See you soon.

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-15 09:48:47

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de pj, postée le 2004-12-15 10:17:24 (S | E)
This phrase, meaning "to deteriorate rapidly", originated in the
U.S. A handbasket is just a basket with a handle. Something carried in a handbasket goes wherever it's going without much resistance.

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de larenaudiere, postée le 2004-12-17 07:27:39 (S | E)
PJ,you are good at expressions.Clues to the origin of going to hell in a handbasket,meaning deteriorating rapidly or utterly,are,unfortunately,scarce as hens' teeth.
The slang historian E. Partridge,in his dictionary,dates the term to the early 1920's.C.Ammer,in her "Have a Nice Day--No problem, a dictionary of cliches, agrees that the phrase dates to the 20th century,and notes that the alliteration of "hell" and "handbasket" contribued to the popularity of the saying.Ms Ammer goes further and ventures that,since handbaskets are light and easily conveyed,the term means going to hell easily and rapidly.That seems a bit of a stretch to me,but I do think the addition of " in a handbasket" (or "in a bucket" as one variant puts it) does sound more dire and hopeless than simply "going to hell."

PJ,please,do you happen to know why I can't write this text properly?

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Edité par larenaudiere le 2004-12-17 08:26:44

Réponse: re:Expressions / jeu de serena, postée le 2004-12-17 09:14:36 (S | E)
Hello larenaudière !

Sorry, I didn't pay attention to your last expression earlier. But pj did the job, and it's ok.

As for your text, I understand quite well what you mean. So, why do you ask if your writing is good ? I don't think you have problems expressing yourself in English ! You do well, you know.

Thanks for this new expression I've already written down.

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