Subjonctif..

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Subjonctif..
Message de mae_lia posté le 28-03-2005 à 01:00:22 (S | E | F | I)
Hello!!

I have again a problem with subjunctive form().
Can we say: I don't understand the fact that Peter have?has? such a car.
(Je ne comprends pas le fait qu'il AIT une telle voiture)!

And how could we say:
Je suis contente que tu le saches!
(i'm glad you to know it? I'm glad that you know it? I think that the first form would be correcter since there is a personal subject -I-...)

Well, what do you think about that?

Thanks very much

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Edité par bridg le 28-03-2005 01:10

Réponse: Subjonctif.. de jardin62, postée le 28-03-2005 à 07:20:37 (S | E)

In the big Harrap's you have:
- What I can't understand is that... (+subj)
But I do prefer :
-I can't understand his having a car (in French, sorry for that!= je ne peux pas comprendre/ je ne peux pas m'expliquer / je ne peux concevoir/ qu'il ait une voiture)
*2nd ex: very simply => I am glad ('that' isn't compulsory)) you know it.
( I want you to know )
Bye'

Réponse: mae_lia de mae_lia, postée le 28-03-2005 à 11:57:49 (S | E)
oooh...Why is it so "compliquéé??????"

But...Instead of "his having"...Could we say: " I can't understand the fact that he has"...? No I don't think so...??

Then, If we want to say: "Je ne comprends pas qu'il soit comme ça"

We say: I don't understand HIS BEING like that?

Is that form only behind "understand"?Or are there another verbs behind which there would be " possessive + verb+ ing?"

Réponse: Subjonctif.. de ruofei, postée le 28-03-2005 à 22:51:11 (S | E)
Hello Maelia
I think you mix both tenses: “subjonctif francais” has nothing to do with “English subjunctive” whatsoever:
Je ne comprends pas le fait qu’il AIT une telle voiture.
(the French idiom ‘le fait que’, among others, requires the subjonctif….English doesn’t)

English has its own ways to translate the French 'subjonctif':
Il faut que tu fasses tes devoirs: you must/have to do your homework
Il est entré sans que je m’en apercoive: he came in without me noticing.Je voudrais que tu me dises la verite: I’d like you to tell me the truth
Il semble qu’il ait fait une erreur: it seems that he made a mistake.
……Always bear in mind that English and French tenses modes are not equivalent!

What is called: subjunctif, in English is rather formal. (infinitive form, for all persons, for all tenses). We usually happen to see them with suggestions or sentences, which express that it is essential that something be or not be done:
I insist that you arrive on time.
I recommend that you change your mind.
He insisted that I not stay on my own. ( without ‘do)
It was essential that the kids not leave home. ( without ‘do’)
This form is very usual in the USA (as Traviskidd once said). In England, they insert ‘should’ (e.g: I insist that you should arrive on time)

I revise your post here:
Why does it have to be so complicated??
In the sentence: ‘I can’t understand…’, could we say ‘he has’ instead of ‘his having’?
Also, can we translate “Je ne comprends pas qu’il soit…” into: ‘I don’t understand….’
Do we find that form possessive + gerund only after the verb ‘understand’ or are there other verbs concerned?

I can’t understand his having such a car.
I don’t understand why/the fact that he has such a car [OK]
I can’t possibly understand why he’s got such a car
I don’t understand why he is like that.

You generally find this form when it’s the subject of a clause:
My being here makes him feel better.
My getting married pleases my parents.
Further approaches:
Do you mind my smoking? (me: informal)
I’m annoyed with your being here. (you: informal)
How can I accept your forgetting to say ‘Hi’?
You can count on my doing my best!

I don’t think there actually are specific expressions or verbs that require this form…It in fact simplifies the grammar and it also comes down to how you want to emphasize your saying.

Réponse: Subjonctif.. de traviskidd, postée le 29-03-2005 à 02:09:37 (S | E)
But in any case, you do NOT use the subjunctive with "I don't understand the fact that...."

You do not use the subjunctive with known facts.

And it's: I'm glad (that) you know (it)!!!

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